Laura D’Asaro

Beth Chesterton: Welcome to ABC to CEO's Preparing for the Possibility Podcast. Today we have a very special guest, one of my very favorite people, Laura D'Asaro, who is the CEO of Chirps. And she's had quite an interesting career already. Welcome, Laura, I can't wait to talk to you today.

Laura D'Asaro: Thanks so much for having me on the show.

Beth Chesterton: Thank you. Where are you situated, today?

Laura D'Asaro: I am in Seattle, Washington, in my apartment.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, fantastic. As you know, ABC to CEO's mission is to prepare young women for the possibility of CEO, to really develop the next generation. It's our way to create balance at the highest levels is, how can we help women, and young women in particular, prepare. You are an example of somebody who's had quite an accelerated career. Tell us a little bit about your role today, and a little bit about your story of how you got here

Laura D'Asaro: Sure, I'm the cofounder and CEO of Chirps. And we do something that maybe is a little unusual. We make food with insect as a more sustainable protein source. We make cricket chips, cricket cookies. We wholesale cricket powder. So, anything to do with eating insects, we're the place to go. And I started the company right out of college. So, we can talk about that.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, it's always exciting to talk about your college experience, was a little different than most people's. But before we go backwards, just bring us into Chirps. Chirps has become quite a phenomenon. It gives an example of where somebody might find Chirps and why they would want to eat chirps.

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, definitely. Our website is probably a good place to look if you want to buy it where we sell, Amazon. During the pandemic, it got a little weird, but we're starting to get back into stores and so zoos, museums, aquariums, grocery stores. We got a store locator that you can check it out.

Beth Chesterton: And why should somebody today eat Chirps?

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, it's a good question. I was an African Studies major in college, didn't expect to get into eating insects. But I had my first insect when I studied abroad in Tanzania. And they were just selling caterpillars as street food across the border in Uganda. There were fried grasshoppers. So, basically ate an insect, ate a caterpillar. And my first thought was, "This tastes good, just like a fried shrimp, kind of." And I just started doing research, and turns out that more people eat insects than speak English. It's super common, and it's super sustainable, just one of the best protein sources for you and the planet.

Beth Chesterton: We've got a compelling case, and I think it's great the way you-- one of the things you're going to love about Laura is how she can communicate and compel you to want to do something. So, for people who think, "Oh, yuck. Insects?", you're saying more people eat insects than speak English. Pretty great statistic. So here you are, let's go back in time, you're an African Studies major. Now, I don't see that as the typical path to CEO.

Laura D'Asaro: Fair, no.

Beth Chesterton: But what you are is also an innovator, and really, you're an inventor. You're abroad, I mean, you're in Africa, and you realize more people are eating insects than speaking English, and they taste pretty good. Then, what do you start to think and do?

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, I just started to experiment, I got curious. And basically, got back to the United States and tried to see where can I get insects here. There was a small shop that had grasshopper sushi, and I checked that out. I found out that there's Mexican restaurants that served chapulines, which are grasshoppers in tacos. Just started trying everything that was out there, and also seeing what insects I could get my hands on to do some experiments in my kitchen.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, so now imagine, Laura's at Harvard, she's an undergraduate study and she's in a dorm, you really want to be in her dorm, because what's happening in your dorm?

Laura D'Asaro: [laughs] Well, actually at this point, I had graduated, but I was back at Harvard, because my cofounder was still there. So, we were in a college dorm. So, yeah, basically, we were cooking up insects and feeding them to our friends. We'd go up to friends and we like, "Hey, you want to try a chocolate chip cricket cookie?" "Hey, you want to try some fried mealworms?" Just basically, making all sorts of different things and just seeing how people reacted. We give people whole mealworms and they'd be like, "Gross, I won't eat it." But if we put it into cookies, maybe they'd be more excited about it, those kinds of tests.

Beth Chesterton: So, she's testing and trying and you have to know she's willing-- curiosity trumps any kind of fear of failure for you. You're just playing and seeing what happens. But you told me there could still be crickets to this day in some of the dormitories where you're testing.

Laura D'Asaro: [laughs] It's quite possible. We had all sorts of ideas. We were like, "Maybe we should make an insect farm." We were ordering these live boxes of insects. I think the front desk was like, "What is going on?" Definitely some escaped crickets.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, so what happened next?

Laura D'Asaro: We started figuring out things that worked. We found out that making things that were crunchy work. We found out that making the insects into a powder helps people get over it. Because basically, in American food culture, we don't eat whole animals. We don't eat whole cows. We don't eat whole pigs. We barely eat a whole fish. So, we decided it had to be the same thing for insects. If people were going to eat insects, we had to put it into a more Americanized form. So, we started making cricket powder. So, just crickets milled into this fine nutty powder, to kind of like sunflower seeds and started making different recipes with it.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, many of you who are listening or watching this, may know Laura's story. But she has a very exciting thing that happens. And it's you and Rose at this point, your cofounder. And what's the next catapult for Chirps?

Laura D'Asaro: The biggest one was that we got a product, got a manufacturer and then we got on Shark Tank.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, how did that happen?

Laura D'Asaro: We were living in San Francisco. At this point, we'd moved, finished college and all of that. And they were live Shark Tank auditions in the city. A friend of ours found out about this and kind of just dared us to go. So, we kind of found ourselves outside of this building standing in line for our Shark Tank audition.

Beth Chesterton: What ends up happening on Shark Tank?

Laura D'Asaro: We did a deal with Mark Cuban, which was huge, because we had this wild, wacky idea about insects, but having him on board was this huge legitimizing force.

Beth Chesterton: Now, paint the picture for us. Laura's had the most interesting upbringing. She's truly been inventing since you were, I don't know, toddling. But how do you sort of create some buzz, if you will, on Shark Tank?

Laura D'Asaro: I love costume making. I kind of have since I was in elementary school. That's probably what brings you there. And I wanted some way for our episode to stand out. So, I made this huge bug costume. I found this laundry hamper downstairs, covered it with green fabric, had this big bug hat with eyes and antennas. And basically, burst out from behind this banner. That's kind of the introduction to the show.

Beth Chesterton: So, he begins to probably know, "This has got some real legs on it," if you will, this idea of yours. And so, he makes a deal. And what do you guys do?

Laura D'Asaro: Well, we take the money. That was really important. And that allows us to make our first products. So, we make cricket chips, cricket cookies I mentioned, and just kind of start hitting the streets, talking to stores, trying to see where we can get this and who wants to eat insects.

Beth Chesterton: I imagine that you have quite a celebration too, when you sort of win Shark Tank. You've got Mark Cuban on board, and there's got to be quite a party at that point.

Laura D'Asaro: I lose it at the end. If you watch the episode, I'm a little embarrassed at the end. I can't even function as a human. I've just broken, I'm so excited.

Beth Chesterton: Well, who wouldn't be? And at this point, how old are you, may I ask?

Laura D'Asaro: Oh, gosh, it was 2017, I was 26, I think?

Beth Chesterton: Amanda, who's the executive producer of the Preparing for the Possibility podcast said she already sees the title of this is "From Shark Tank to CEO." At this point, does Rose become the CEO?

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, basically, at first, my cofounder college roommate is CEO. And then, I eventually take over from it. She had more of a business background. You mentioned I was an African Studies major. So, I didn't actually start out as CEO, but eventually grew into the role.

Beth Chesterton: And you're both cofounders of this project, and you actually end up bringing-- it seems like almost every grocery store across the country was carrying Chirps before the pandemic.

Laura D'Asaro: We were in 1500 stores. We were the first insect product in any major grocery store. We're talking Kroger, we're talking Barnes & Noble, Vitamin Shoppe.

Beth Chesterton: Talk about legitimate. And you personally, along with Rose and your team, are convincing people, are compelling them to try something they've never done before. Many of the people who are eating your chips have never had insects before.

Laura D'Asaro: Almost nobody. I think most people's introduction was finding our product in the grocery store. We tried to have little educational shelf talkers and things, but the question went from how do we convince people to eat insects when we're standing in front of them, to how do we convince people to eat insects when we're not there?

Beth Chesterton: And obviously, you were very successful at doing this and your success is undeniable. What year do you move from becoming one of the cofounders to CEO?

Laura D'Asaro: I think that is 2018. I might be getting my years wrong a little bit, but right around there, right about a year or two after Shark Tank.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, because we're about preparing young women for the possibility of becoming CEO, did you ever dream of being a CEO when you were a young girl?

Laura D'Asaro: Gosh, not-- I'd love [unintelligible 00:10:32]. I did all of that kind of thing. But I come from a family of scientists and so it was kind of more of that role. It took a little bit of a mental shift to see myself, I guess, in that role.

Beth Chesterton: Well, talk about that where were the stretches for you? What were some things that came naturally for you? We talk about 17 traits of highly effective CEOs. The ability to adapt, the ability to inspire. I know you well enough to know you have a terrific ability to inspire. But where were there some areas that you had what it took, and where were there's some stretch assignments for you, as CEO?

Laura D'Asaro: I think I'm naturally a visionary, have big ideas, know where things are going. That part came easily. What didn't come so easily, I think was when you're CEO, you're thinking about your team members all the time. It's not just about the vision, it's how are we functioning day to day? How do I help each of these people on my team grow? And what do you do when it's not exactly in line where you see the company going this direction, but this person has a different skill set? There gets to be trickiness, where it's not just about the team is helping me get to the vision, but it's about how do you bring everyone along and have them be part of that as well.

Beth Chesterton: That's a real challenge. Can you give us an example of something you did you grow in this area?

Laura D'Asaro: Great question. I think one thing that I did was that whenever something didn't go well, I think that it was very easy for me to just not want to think about it. We as humans like to be good at things. My natural instinct was to just be like, "Well, I'm never thinking of that again." But I would journal every time. Something didn't go well-- I fired someone early on, we'll go into too many details since it's public, but I fired someone early on and it didn't go well. And I made myself sit with that. I made myself sit with it, journal, talk about what I would do better next time, talk to advisors about that. Really lean into your failures.

Beth Chesterton: Okay, I love that advice. And having been a person who was talking to you at that time, throughout your time of becoming CEO, I think that it was really important for you, you owned so much of what you weren't doing well. But one of the things I think we need to remind young women to do is to then spend some equal amount of time marinating in what you actually are doing well. And that's different than bragging, it's really recognizing what is it that you're doing that's working. And sometimes, I feel that we're too quick to not focus on that either. I feel you did both, I'm going to focus on what's not working. But you had to be forced sometimes to focus on what you were doing that was actually working.

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, I guess I did both where I would also think about what was right-- And I think with our employees in particular, they say that the best kind of feedback is specific positive feedback, because if someone does something well, they've already done it. And if you're able to help them identify that, then they can do it again. And so, that was a big part of something that perhaps I'm not even mentioning right now because it came naturally to me was that just make sure when someone does something that is just beyond fabulous, call it out. And then, they're going to do it again.

Beth Chesterton: That's exactly right. Because there's so much unconscious competence about when we're doing something well, because it comes so naturally sometimes. And it's those things that come naturally as breathing that people don't see in themselves. And you, as a leader, got really good and I think helping people see what they were doing that was contributing.

You go on to get your MBA at Stanford. Talk about why you decided to get an MBA.

Laura D'Asaro: I just finished my MBA at Stanford, it was an awesome experience. I think, basically, I had run Chirps for about seven years myself, and I'd learned a bunch, but it was also I went straight from college into doing this. And I felt like there were still some gaps around a little bit more formal education of around leadership, around accounting, around finance, a lot of these things. So, that was big for me. At Stanford, also just building a community of other people and getting to spend two years reflecting on challenges and leadership issues, all of that.

Beth Chesterton: But it sounds like it was an incredible program. And I know that now here you are, you've had your Stanford MBA under your belt. You just accomplished it, you're CEO of Chirps. I'm wondering, I know people ask you all the time for advice, what would be your advice to entrepreneurs, and especially to female entrepreneurs?

Laura D'Asaro: I think the biggest thing that helps me and I think you actually helped me realize I even do this, but it's when you have an idea, taking some kind of action on it immediately. I think we all have ideas. "I'm going to start a jewelry business." "I'm going to write a book." But so often, even with me, this happens, so often those ideas just stay as ideas. So, something that I think maybe differentiates me is when I came up with the idea for Chirps, five minutes later, I was googling places that you could get insects, I was looking at insect recipes, I was calling friends and saying, "Hey, you want to come to a bug cook off?" And so that's, I think, my advice, is when you've got that energy, that energy is so rare. When you're excited about something, you have to use that energy and put it towards an action before it goes away. And then, once you've got a call scheduled, maybe next week-- let's say you want to write a book, you've got a call scheduled with another author, maybe next week, you're not sure you get the doubt seep in, but you've got that call, and you're going to take it and it just helps you move yourself forward towards whatever you want to do.

Beth Chesterton: First of all, I love this. And this is one of the things about Laura. We each have our own gifts and talents. For those who are listening, if this isn't one of your natural ways of being, you can imitate shamelessly. And that is that Laura has a very short path for her between idea and movement towards implementation. She just goes directly for it, it doesn't stop. And there's been many inventions that Laura has pursued, and Chirps is just her most famous one at this moment, most well known. But then speed bumps, as you said, when the doubts come in, you still take action.

Laura D'Asaro: I have this sticky note on my computer, which I'll take off and show you for a second. And it says, "Action creates inspiration, not the other way around." And what that means for me, I keep this here because, I'm generally an inspired person, but I definitely get my speed bumps. And I don't feel like doing any. I don't feel like working on something. When it gets hard, it's unpleasant. And I have to remind myself that when I do something, when I keep that ball rolling, that's going to make me feel inspired. It's not that I need the inspiration to get started.

Beth Chesterton: I love that because I think that so often, we do wait for inspiration to come. It's like weather, you're saying, "No, it's not weather. You can have something you can do to control inspiration by taking action, or to ignite inspiration."

Laura D'Asaro: I also have a rule around something like, let's say, you want to write a book, my rule is basically do something every single day. And things happen in life. You skip a day. You have a family thing. But that means the next day you get back on it and you do something, and that way, you're creating a habit.

Beth Chesterton: Fantastic. Now, what's it like to be CEO of your own company that's based on your own idea, something you birthed, so to speak?

Laura D'Asaro: [chuckles] I mean, there's some really fantastic parts. I remember the first time we saw our product on a store shelf, and it was just like the coolest thing. And to see somebody using your product you don't know, it's the most exciting feeling to bring something that is in your head into the world.

Beth Chesterton: Yes, I can only imagine what that's like and to see that when other people take your idea, how does that feel when you're CEO? And now it's not just your idea, it's everyone's idea. It's everybody's livelihood. How does that feel?

Laura D'Asaro: I think that's where it comes down to building a team where you are aligned and you're bringing people into your vision. I think, as a founder, sometimes I can get kind of stuck at where I want to go. But almost always it ends up being better where it's a shared vision. The products and the company, everything, it wasn't exactly my vision. In the beginning, I wanted to do cookies, and we ended up doing chips, like different packaging than I wanted. But in the end, building something together with other people is just so much more rewarding. It's wonderful to feel like it's the "We" and not the "Me" as well and feel like you are part of something bigger on your team and in the world.

Beth Chesterton: And Laura, ABC to CEO, some of the work you do actually intersects a little bit. Can you, in wrapping up, talk a little bit about the book that you've written for young girls?

Laura D'Asaro: Sure, actually, I have a copy. I keep it on my desk.

Beth Chesterton: Fantastic.

Laura D'Asaro: It's called Project Startup. And it's a middle-grade fiction, I think like third through fifth, sixth grade. And it's about two girls who start a business making food with insects. So, if you have any young readers in your life, it's a good one.

Beth Chesterton: That's fantastic. And one more thing I want to ask you about in terms of being a young female CEO, do you see anything in young women? Let's say college aged, early career that you would like to give them some advice about or something that young women could be doing that could be helpful?

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah. Gosh, I guess the first thing that comes to mind is that just the way society is that we've had a lot of old male CEOs for a very long time, I think that as young women, we just need to step up a little bit more and remind people who we are. I'll give you an example. One of our first hires was in operations and he was this tall, I don't know, 6'3" guy. And when we went to conferences together, people just automatically assumed that he was CEO, like would come up to him, shake his hand. At first, I didn't really know what to do. He would correct them and point to me. But over time, I realized that this was just going to happen, put your shoulders back a little bit, stand up a little straighter, and you preemptive it. So, when we met someone, I would just take a step forward, shake their hand, introduce myself. I think it's sometimes just those little things that help other people just get used to this new idea of young female CEOs in general. Just help them work with you and make it clear who you are.

Beth Chesterton: I think that's a really great point about really stepping up and helping just to remind people. And the more that people are in your role doing that, and stepping up, we're going start to change the way we see what's possible for women and CEO.

Laura D'Asaro: Yeah, it's a weird mix between how much do you change, and how much do you ask people to change. It's always like this internal struggle. I remember when I first started doing phone calls for trying to find a manufacturer, I got on the phone and be like, "Hi, I'm from Chirps and we're looking for a manufacturer." My cofounder told me, "You need to lower your voice, and you need to slow down." And I felt really offended. I was like, "This is my voice. This is who I am. I don't want to change." But then in the next phone call, I picked it up, and I slowed down and I lowered my voice, and it worked better. So, it's always that tension of how do we find something that is authentic to us, but that also perhaps works better? And I think it's an ongoing struggle, but I would say, I think I've learned that there's lots of people that we can be and I've been trying to expand my own idea of my identity and role as a businesswoman.

Beth Chesterton: This is fantastic. I thank you so much for your time. I hope we can talk again soon. I just love that you took the time and we're going to be excited to share this with young women. And I can tell you, as always, you will inspire and educate. Thank you so much for taking the time.

Laura D'Asaro: Thank you for having me.

Laura is the co-founder of Chirps, a company making food with insects as a more sustainable protein source. She helped pioneer the edible insect industry in the US, founding Chirps at a time when insect consumption was nearly unheard of. In just five years, she managed to secure an investment from Mark Cuban on the hit-show Shark Tank, earn an impressive list of awards and fellowships including Echoing Green and Forbes 30 Under 30, and bring insect products to 1500+ stores. In addition, Laura holds the Guinness World Record for the Fastest Time to Crawl One Mile.